Wikipedia talk:Babel

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Difference between definition of native in :babel/levels page and :babel (general) page

The general page has the line of "xx (no hyphen or number) for native-born speakers who use a language every day and have a thorough grasp of it, including colloquialisms and idioms. Note: We do not quibble about the "native-born" part; it's the "including colloquialisms and idioms" part that matters here." and yet the levels page does not mention that at all, which feels contradictory. In fact it actually lists basically the opposite, where several examples are mentioned only taking into account moving from X country to Y country, which the general page would say is less important compared to being able to understand cultural references and idioms. I suggest to insert the prior note from the general page under the xx-N section in the levels page to avoid confusion, is anyone against this? Sebrana (talk) 23:53, 27 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Edited :babel/levels in the relevant section to make up for it. Sebrana (talk) 00:29, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

tok-5

The template Template:User tok-5 used to say what was effectively the same thing as Template:User tok-4 did, and so many proficient speakers have used it on their userpages. However, level 5 is meant to signify a professional level in the language. When going through and updating the local versions of Toki Pona Babel templates to match mw:Extension:Babel's translations, I realized that quite a few users' pages now say that they have a professional level of Toki Pona proficiency / use it in their work. I know a few of those users off-wiki, and I know that most don't use the language professionally.

It would be redundant to have two templates with very similar messages, but leaving an inaccurate message on many userpages feels wrong. Anything that should be done? Ookap (talk) 10:47, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Order

@SamB and Ynhockey: The ordering was changed in 2014 for the apparently random reason "Rejigger some stuff". This was propagated here and elsewhere at {{user language subcategory}} in 2018. Did any expert source say that "professional is higher-level than simply native"? "1 2 3 4 N 5" looks just wrong.

c:Commons:Babel uses the common sense "1 2 3 4 5 N". It has been repeatedly discussed that the same system is used for all Wikimedia projects ... Since several hundred projects use the same system, we must not vary the system locally. A later edit here did not find the "rejigger"ed order the least bit natural, and neither does {{user x}}.

Let's restore the original, more reasonable order "1 2 3 4 5 N". 174.94.28.189 (talk) 00:47, 4 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Hebrew and Arabic

Hebrew and Arabic verb forms change depending on gender. Should we modify the userboxes for those languages to change depending on the user's gender using {{gender:{{ROOTPAGENAME}}|him|her|them}}? Gommeh 📖/🎮 19:21, 15 September 2025 (UTC)[reply]