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This template was considered for deletion on 2020 April 18. The result of the discussion was "do not merge".
I am trying to change this back to "Psycho", and I did, but it still comes up Halloween.— Preceding unsigned comment added by Jabrona (talk • contribs)
I had first removed the very strong black, replacing it with a dark gray. Black, in a normal article (e.g. Saci Day), is absurdly polluting and adds nothing to the navbox. Then, based on WP:NAVCOLOR, I chose to remove all the colors, since they are unjustified, and I maintain that they add nothing of value. I based this on the Christmas navbox, which until recently had an explosive shade of red, but now thankfully uses the default color. Randy Kryn reverted me because the colors are "associated with the holiday", although I question where they are, and if they truly are, why that is, and whether that should have any influence over the navbox. @Ibadibam and Woodensuperman: pinging users who participated in the discussion regarding the Christmas navbox. RodRabelo7 (talk) 03:37, 23 July 2025 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, black and orange are associated with Halloween. School colors of a sort. A main reason the Christmas navbox was changed was to make sure the links stood out enough for readers to discern them. That's not an issue here. Randy Kryn (talk) 04:23, 23 July 2025 (UTC)[reply]
I think the colours should be removed. Just because it looks festive is not a good reason to deviate from the standard colour scheme. It's distracting. --woodensuperman05:53, 23 July 2025 (UTC)[reply]
It's Halloween and Wikipedia, not just-another-holiday and Drabapedia. These are long-term colors with no reason to change them other than "I'm not liking it". If, even for a tenth-of-a-second, the reader is reminded of the feeling of the holiday by the colors of the navbox, it has fulfilled a descriptive and emotional-navigation purpose. Now maybe if we had ghosts and AI generated witches floating in and above the navbox it would be a little distracting (but fun), yet pointing out the colors of the holiday, in Wikipedia style, does no harm and enough good to continue to exist. Randy Kryn (talk) 12:02, 23 July 2025 (UTC)[reply]
There, have moved the links in question, now the links are explained without having to change the long-term colors (except for the category link at the bottom, and you don't like category links on navboxes anyway). Decorative elements are fine if they make an educational and encyclopedic point, which this does. Randy Kryn (talk) 12:59, 23 July 2025 (UTC)[reply]
Are orange and black universal colors for Halloween / All Saints Eve, or are they particular to a narrower subset of the cultures that celebrate this holiday? If the latter, then the reason for removing them from the template is stated not only in MOS:NAVBOXCOLOR but also in WP:NPOV. Ibadibam (talk) 19:59, 23 July 2025 (UTC)[reply]
Use any search engine and the term 'European Halloween'. Black and orange images are everywhere. Those colors are not "very U.S. centric", they seem to be universal (although other colors are mentioned, orange and black look to be the notable common colors of Halloween). Randy Kryn (talk) 03:33, 25 July 2025 (UTC)[reply]
This is why it's okay to remove yourself from the conversation for days. Just thought of this obvious point a few hours ago) There are probably hundreds of colored navboxes. If you work in navboxes, as woodensuperman and I do, you often see them. {{Notre_Dame_Fighting_Irish_football_navbox}} is literally the first one I thought to check, and there it is, colors. Navbox coloring is often used for colleges, sports teams, lots of things. If the goal is to remove colors from navboxes, please consider taking this deletion argument (deletion of a long-term signifying element) to one of the major college navboxes. Doing that would alert more editors (although it would probably need a widely known, all relevant navboxes alerted, RfC). Randy Kryn (talk) 03:00, 25 July 2025 (UTC)[reply]
A university chooses its own colors and publishes brand identity guidelines that make those colors easy to verify. An international holiday's symbols are generated by the various cultures that celebrate it and vary from place to place and time to time. My sense is that the current colors here only represent a narrow subset of those cultures, which means that the colors' use in this navbox misrepresents the holiday when taken as a sum of its many traditions. Ibadibam (talk) 03:35, 25 July 2025 (UTC)[reply]
Patience please RodRabelo7. I do not like arguing Wikipedia topics every day, and often will take one, two, or a few days off. Wikipedia conversations are not truly time sensitive if the time is short enough. As for the essay 'Silence', I point out above how that was an inaccurate reading of the essay. Thanks. Will be back at some point soon, but yes, the colors of a holiday are informative and recognizable by most. Randy Kryn (talk) 23:44, 24 July 2025 (UTC)[reply]
