Talk:Skate America

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GA review

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This review is transcluded from Talk:Skate America/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Nominator: Bgsu98 (talk · contribs) 02:38, 5 May 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Reviewer: Figureskatingfan (talk · contribs) 17:21, 22 May 2025 (UTC)[reply]

As per the nominator's request, I will review this article for GAN. I'm an experienced editor of and contributor to articles about figure skating, and an active member of the Figure Skating WikiProject. I support the improvement of these kinds of articles, so I'm excited to review this one. Christine (Figureskatingfan) (talk) 17:21, 22 May 2025 (UTC)[reply]

GA review (see here for what the criteria are, and here for what they are not)
  1. It is reasonably well written.
    a (prose, spelling, and grammar): b (MoS for lead, layout, word choice, fiction, and lists):
    Nice job. You do a really good job at using only the information in your sources that applies to the specific article you're working on, which is something I struggle with. For example, I don't think the prize money that ref3 talks about belongs here; it better fits into the main article about the Grand Prix. In other words, you make good editorial choices.
  2. It is factually accurate and verifiable, as shown by a source spot-check.
    a (reference section): b (inline citations to reliable sources): c (OR): d (copyvio and plagiarism):
    See below for source review.
  3. It is broad in its coverage.
    a (major aspects): b (focused):
    I had a few questions about comprehensiveness; see below.
  4. It follows the neutral point of view policy.
    Fair representation without bias:
  5. It is stable.
    No edit wars, etc.:
    Very stable; only 2 editors since April 2025.
  6. It is illustrated by images and other media, where possible and appropriate.
    a (images are tagged and non-free content have non-free use rationales): b (appropriate use with suitable captions):
    One question: can you find any more recent images for the lead images? If not, they're fine. Great photos.
  • Do you mean the photos of the medalists? Those were the best I could find. I wanted four different years with a variety of nations and all visually similar (in this case, close-up with a dark background). Bgsu98 (Talk) 02:54, 23 May 2025 (UTC)[reply]
  1. Overall:
    Pass/Fail:
    Great job, will pass once the outstanding issues are addressed.

Prose review
History

  • "...was the test event for the 1980 Winter Olympics." I know what the term "test event" means, but I'm not sure that the initiated reader/figure skating fan would. The source calls the event "a dummy run", but that's also unclear. Please explain that it means that it was one of the competitions that determined the American skaters who would be eligible for the 1980 Olympics.
  • That is not what was meant by "test event". Amazingly enough, Wikipedia doesn't have information about Olympic test events – which are basically dress rehearsals run ahead of time to test the facilities where the Olympic events will be held – but I found a great article that discusses them. Bgsu98 (Talk) 03:21, 23 May 2025 (UTC)[reply]
Oh really, I'm embarrassed to admit that I was mistaken about that. This is kinda unrelated, but perhaps the article about test events should go into Figure skating competition, which is horrible sourced, even though there's lots of information about it in sources like the ISU rules documents and the like. I suggest that you put the source you've mentioned into the competitions talk page. Christine (Figureskatingfan) (talk) 00:58, 27 May 2025 (UTC)[reply]
I think that your solution is fine. Christine (Figureskatingfan) (talk) 00:59, 27 May 2025 (UTC)[reply]
  • "This series also provided the viewing public with additional televised skating, which had been in demand." The viewing public: where? In the U.S., or internationally? I suspect that Hines doesn't explain, so you might want to resort to quoting him, at least partially, like this: "Figure skating historian James R. Hines reported that the event "provided the viewing public..." or however he may put it. (I've used Hines extensively myself, and he's a notoriously unclear writer. But enough with my bellyaching about him.) ;)
  • Yeah, who knows... I put quotes around it. I'm going to assume in the country hosting the event, since Germany ended up losing their GP event to China over television rights. Bgsu98 (Talk) 03:21, 23 May 2025 (UTC)[reply]
Again, nice solution. Christine (Figureskatingfan) (talk) 01:00, 27 May 2025 (UTC)[reply]
  • I like what you said about the 2020 Skate America. (Wow, what a sad time that was for figure skating, but please ignore my diversion and commentary.) ;) I wonder if you should explain what "bubble" means, but it's up to you if you think it's necessary. This brings up a question, though: were there any other Skate Americas that were unusual and/or special? For example, why was the event cancelled in 1980 (the boycott of the 1980 Winter Olympics?) and in 1987? I ask this for comprehensiveness sake. If you're unable to find any sources about it, that's fine. If not, it won't affect the passage of this article to GA.

Source review

  • Ref1 supports the first three sentences in the second paragraph of the History section, which is unnecessary. I suggest that you remove the first instance.
  • Same problem for ref2; it supports all the statements/sentences in the first paragraph. I suggest solving it in the same way as above.
Never mind, it got fixed when you added the sentence about test events. Christine (Figureskatingfan) (talk) 01:08, 27 May 2025 (UTC)[reply]
  • Ref4: This source doesn't support your statement about the finals. It's just a list of the competitors. If you want to list who made it into the finals, you can place it in a footnote; i.e., "See here [with link] for the competitors who were eligible for the finals." Your statement is supported, however, by ref3, so you should use it instead. (Another tangent: I've noticed that this is a common problem in many figure skating articles, that the sources that are used don't always support the statements made. Often, that's an easy fix, as it is here, but other times, it is not, and the statement should be removed in those cases.)
Okay, thanks! Christine (Figureskatingfan) (talk) 01:12, 27 May 2025 (UTC)[reply]
  • I only checked the first six refs (refs 2, 9-13) in the Medalists tables, because I'm lazy and because I trust (and am familiar with) the nominator's fastidiousness, especially in regards to tables and results. The refs that support the Skate Americas from 1979 to 2002 are from Skating, and the refs that support 2003 onward are mostly from Skating Scores, which is fine. Ref50 brings you to 2024 Skate America, though. You might want to double-check your links; I'll AGF that you've taken care of it as per my request.
No problem, thanks again. Christine (Figureskatingfan) (talk) 01:12, 27 May 2025 (UTC)[reply]
  • Ref54: The link on Eldridge's webpage doesn't support the statement made; it's elsewhere in his webpage, though. I wasn't able to find the specific years; you may need to list a source from each win.
  • I added a different source that identifies each Skate America win.
  • Ref55: This source doesn't specifically state the specific years Kwan won Skate America, although the information is there, scattered throughout the page. You may think that this is overly picky, but I strongly think that sources must support what's being said in an article and not imply it, as I think it does in this case. Again, the solution may be to list a source for each win, as clunky a solution that might be.
  • Refs56&57: Similar issue as above. In this case, the reader is forced to count every time both Eltsova and Bushkov and Belbin and Agosto won SA to verify the information.
  • These sources do identify each year and the placement. Eltsova/Bushkov's source identifies that they won Skate America in 1990, 1992, 1994, 1995, and 1997. And the same for the other sources. Simply adding up the gold medals doesn't qualify as original research.
  • Where did you get the information for the Cumulative medal count section? Or is that something that's not typically sourced?
  • It's just a tabulation of the tables listed above.

User:Figureskatingfan, thank you for taking the time to do this thoughtul review. I just have the one question about what you mean in regards to sourcing in the History section; everything else should be addressed. Bgsu98 (Talk) 03:41, 23 May 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Pinging User:Figureskatingfan. Bgsu98 (Talk) 17:12, 26 May 2025 (UTC)[reply]
We can agree to disagree about if tabulating the gold medal counts qualifies as OR, but the information is important enough to include, so I won't make a big deal out of it here. That's discussion for another time, probably by the Figure Skating WikiProject. I'm fine with tabulating the tables, since it's a traditional thing in articles about competitions. I'm fine with the other changes you made.
You're very welcome, my pleasure. Keep up the good work. I will pass this to GA, congrats. Christine (Figureskatingfan) (talk) 01:18, 27 May 2025 (UTC)[reply]