Talk:Samson Option

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Edit request 21 March 2025

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Description of suggested change:

There's no need to discuss Samson's act in detail. Therefore, only one image of Samson destroying the temple is needed, and the caption talking about how Samson destroyed it is redundant. Apart from that, the assertion that views on both pushing and pulling pillars exist has not yet been verified (discussion). It could be debatable which image should be kept, though I kept the first one as I see the second one a bit messy and did not show much of the Philistine's reactions to Samson's attack.

The above suggestion was made according to the following policies and guidelines:

1. Removing one image: Per MOS:IMAGEREL, for image quantity, less is more. Both images could be recognized as being significant and relevant in the topic's context, though not both are required to serve as an illustrative aid.
2. Shortening the caption: Per WP:CAPTION, captions should draw the reader's attention to the article itself. However, the current caption guides readers to what Samson has done. We should not assume readers interested in political topics would also be interested in religious topics.

I've made the said change on Chinese Wikipedia, please check revision 86523126 there. This should be a straightforward change as it does not involve changing the body texts discussing the Arab–Israeli conflict, an ArbCom-restricted topic, but only redundant images and caption texts.

This is my first time working on an ArbCon-restricted topic. If I have violated any ArbCom decisions or community consensuses, please tell me.

Diff:

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{{multiple image | direction = vertical | width = 180 | header = Samson Option | footer = According to the biblical narrative, [[Samson]] died when he grasped two pillars of the Temple of Dagon, and "bowed himself with all his might" (Judges 16:30, [[KJV]]). This has been variously interpreted as Samson pushing the pillars apart (''top'') or pulling them together (''bottom''). | image1 = 064.The Death of Samson.jpg | alt1 = Pushing | caption1 = | image2 = SamsonDestroyTemple.jpg | alt2 = Pulling | caption2 = }}

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[[File:064.The Death of Samson.jpg|thumb|According to the biblical narrative, [[Samson]] died when he grasped two pillars of the Temple of Dagon, and "bowed himself with all his might" (Judges 16:30, [[KJV]]).]]

1F616EMO (talk) 22:42, 21 March 2025 (UTC)[reply]

 Done, thank you for the suggestion. Smallangryplanet (talk) 10:17, 14 May 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for your help. Hope the on-wiki conflicts that led to the CTOP designation will end soon. 1F616EMO (talk) 17:12, 14 May 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Definition of the Samson Option in the intro

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The summary intro of the page currently describes the Samson Option as Israeli retaliation with nuclear weapons against any country attacking Israel. But the content further down the page clearly states that it's also about the idea of Israel attacking other, non-involved countries, such as European capitals. Essentially taking the rest of the world hostage. I think this should be added to the intro summary. 2A02:AA7:405A:F68A:3C64:C2E7:C558:FD9E (talk) 13:59, 7 May 2025 (UTC)[reply]

 Additional information needed The content on the page doesn't seem to support this, do you have a reliable source that makes this point? (There is an opinion suggesting Israel could try to hit Europe, but nothing verified afaict.) Smallangryplanet (talk) 10:12, 14 May 2025 (UTC)[reply]

There is a significant portion of the article dedicated to the opinions of those describing it in exactly the terms the previous contributor suggested be added to the lead, and those opinions don't come from anti-Israeli sources. I think it's reasonable to mention early on that this is a possible (or alleged) element of the strategy. 2600:4040:3114:EE00:60C5:B586:6DDE:A512 (talk) 19:33, 24 June 2025 (UTC)[reply]

I think they might be "aimed at the west" figuratively / politically rather than literally. This has a little bit in Hebrew כך הגרעין הישראלי הכניע את מעצמות המערב - ללא שהופעל from Kikar HaShabbat (website). Machine translation of title is "This is how the Israeli nuclear weapon subdued the Western powers - without being activated". I'm not sure if I'm supposed to add to this, but I was planning to include that in my own request below and on another page (for the first paragraph, about 1967), but the rest of it might also help with this request above. 2405:6E00:633:4ABB:C866:A30C:B217:FDC3 (talk) 19:02, 27 June 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Edit request 30 June 2025

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Description of suggested change

The current image caption misses the significance of the artist Gustave Doré's illustrations for La Grande Bible de Tours.

The current image caption and part of the introduction would work better as background.

The current background could be expanded into a section on militant suicides, there was one double suicide, originally planned as a suicide attack, that the Lehi called Operation Samson, and an identical name was then used for a nuclear deployment plan in the six day war. I'll add more on that in a second TextDiff if I get time later.

The illustrator of the Bible is mentioned in about a dozen sources about two Zionist militants who blew themselves up in prison in 1947. The illustration set were used for Bibles in a few languages, and I presume the Irgun militant's Bible didn't have the New Testament, but the sources all just say it's a Bible illustrated by Dore.

Moving some text to the background

New caption and moving existing text. I'll add more to the background in a second step so you can distinguish what is added from what was moved.

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[[File:064.The Death of Samson.jpg|thumb| According to the biblical narrative, [[Samson]] died when he grasped two pillars of the Temple of Dagon, and "bowed himself with all his might" (Judges 16:30, [[KJV]]).]] The Samson Option (Hebrew: ברירת שמשון, romanized: b'rerat shimshon) is [[Israel]]'s [[Deterrence theory|deterrence strategy]] of [[massive retaliation]] with [[nuclear weapon]]s as a "last resort" against a country whose military has invaded and/or destroyed much of Israel. Commentators also have employed the term to refer to situations where non-nuclear, non-Israeli actors have threatened [[conventional weapon]]s retaliation.[2 jpost 2004-06-23] The name is a reference to the [[Bible|biblical]] Israelite [[Biblical judges|judge]] [[Samson]] who pushed apart the pillars of a [[Philistines|Philistine]] temple, bringing down the roof and killing himself and thousands of Philistines who had captured him. == Background == See also: Samson When the [[Lehi (militant group)|Lehi militant group]] were discussing ways to assassinate General [[Evelyn Barker]], the British Army commander in [[Mandatory Palestine]], a [[Female suicide bomber |young woman volunteered]] to do the assassination as a [[suicide bombing]]. She said "[[Let my soul die with the Philistines]]<span class="noprint" style="font-size:85%; font-style: normal; "> [[[:he:תמות נפשי עם פלשתים|he]]]</span>" as a reference to the Samson story in the [[Hebrew Bible]]. Other members of the group rejected her offer. == Nuclear ambiguity ==

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[[File:064.The Death of Samson.jpg|thumb| ]] The Samson Option (Hebrew: ברירת שמשון, romanized: b'rerat shimshon) is [[Israel]]'s [[Deterrence theory|deterrence strategy]] of [[massive retaliation]] with [[nuclear weapon]]s as a "last resort" against a country whose military has invaded and/or destroyed much of Israel. The name is a reference to the [[Bible|biblical]] Israelite [[Biblical judges|judge]] [[Samson]] who pushed apart the pillars of a [[Philistines|Philistine]] temple, bringing down the roof and killing himself and thousands of Philistines who had captured him. == Background == See also: Samson According to the biblical narrative, [[Samson]] died when he grasped two pillars of the Temple of Dagon, and "bowed himself with all his might" (Judges 16:30, [[KJV]]). Commentators also have employed the term to refer to situations where non-nuclear, non-Israeli actors have threatened [[conventional weapon]]s retaliation.[2 jpost 2004-06-23] When the [[Lehi (militant group)|Lehi militant group]] were discussing ways to assassinate General [[Evelyn Barker]], the British Army commander in [[Mandatory Palestine]], a [[Female suicide bomber |young woman volunteered]] to do the assassination as a [[suicide bombing]]. She said "[[Let my soul die with the Philistines]]<span class="noprint" style="font-size:85%; font-style: normal; "> [[[:he:תמות נפשי עם פלשתים|he]]]</span>" as a reference to the Samson story in the [[Hebrew Bible]]. Other members of the group rejected her offer. == Nuclear ambiguity ==

1. "Strategic Doctrine". Global Security. April 28, 2005.
2. Hersh 1991, pp. 137. sfn error: no target: CITEREFHersh1991 (help)
3. Beres, Louis René (November 16, 2018). "Israel and the "Samson Option" in an Interconnected World". Modern War Institute. Retrieved July 4, 2023.
4. Keinon, Herb (31 January 2002), "Selling the 'Samson option'", The Jerusalem Post, archived from the original on 2004-06-23
5. "Raskin, Fania – Freedom Fighters of Israel Heritage Association". Archived from the original on 7 July 2022. Fania then spoke up and volunteered herself. She was sure that for an operation such as this, she would find the strength to stand and walk. "My life is no life anyway" she added. This was a "Let my soul die with the Philistines" proposal, the Samson option. Of course, her suggestion was rejected. Fania Raskin passed away on July 20, 1947, in Jerusalem. She was thirty-one.
6. Lehi People לחי אנשים (PDF) (in Hebrew). Tel Aviv. 2002. p. 800. Archived from the original (PDF) on 21 December 2024. Retrieved 21 December 2024. כאשר תוכננה התנקשות בגנרל בארקר, מפקד הצבא הבריטי בארץ־ישראל, הועלה רעיון, שבחורה תטייל עם עגלת תינוק, שתתפוצץ כאשר הגנרל יעבור לידה. נשאלה השאלה איך הבחורה תצליח להסתלק לפני ההתפוצצות. כאן התפרצה פניה והציעה את עצמה. בשביל פעולה כזאת, אמרה, היא תמצא כוחות לעמוד וללכת. ״ממילא חיי אינם חיים״, הוסיפה היא התכוונה לפעולת ״תמות נפשי עם פלשתים״. הצעתה נדחתה, כמובן. פניה רסקין הלכה לעולמה ב־-20.7.1947ג׳ מנחם אב תש״ז, בירושלים והיא בת 31
7. רסקין פַניה – “מרגלית” – העמותה להנצחת מורשת לח״י (in Hebrew).

Building on moved text

The militants who blew themselves up in 1947 feature in a lot of Likud party speeches, particularly by Menachem Begin. Strangely I cannot find Yitzhak Shamir ever mentioning them, but he was possibly just less prone to flamboyant speeches. The "heroic" suicide story Begin kept telling peaked as he got more powerful in national politics, so it sort of fits in the chronology of the sections below, but that might be confusing or distracting for the modern story.

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Caption: The Samson Option (Hebrew: ברירת שמשון, romanized: b'rerat shimshon) is Israel's deterrence strategy of massive retaliation with nuclear weapons as a "last resort" against a country whose military has invaded and/or destroyed much of Israel.[1] The name is a reference to the biblical Israelite judge Samson who pushed apart the pillars of a Philistine temple, bringing down the roof and killing himself and thousands of Philistines who had captured him.[3][4] == Background == See also: Samson According to the biblical narrative, Samson died when he grasped two pillars of the Temple of Dagon, and "bowed himself with all his might" (Judges 16:30, KJV). Commentators also have employed the term to refer to situations where non-nuclear, non-Israeli actors have threatened conventional weapons retaliation.[2 jpost 2004-06-23] When the Lehi militant group were discussing ways to assassinate General Evelyn Barker, the British Army commander in Mandatory Palestine, a young woman volunteered to do the assassination as a suicide bombing.[5][6][7] She said "Let my soul die with the Philistines [he]" as a reference to the Samson story in the Hebrew Bible.[5][6][7] Other members of the group rejected her offer.[5][7][6] == Nuclear ambiguity ==

+

Caption: Illustration of Samson's suicide by [[Gustave Doré]], the illustrator of the Bible that was handed to the British prison guard, shortly before midnight on 21 April 1947, by an [[Irgun]] militant who blew himself up moments later.(Makor Rishon 2017)(Haaretz 29 March 2007) The Samson Option (Hebrew: ברירת שמשון, romanized: b'rerat shimshon) is Israel's deterrence strategy of massive retaliation with nuclear weapons as a "last resort" against a country whose military has invaded and/or destroyed much of Israel.[1] The name is a reference to the biblical Israelite judge Samson who pushed apart the pillars of a Philistine temple, bringing down the roof and killing himself and thousands of Philistines who had captured him.[3][4] The story plays a somewhat central role in Israeli culture, alongside the [[Masada myth]]. The same Biblical references was previously used by pre state militants to refer to suicide operations.(Makor Rishon 2017)[5][6][7] == Background == See also: Samson According to the Biblical narrative, Samson died when he grasped two pillars of the Temple of Dagon, and "bowed himself with all his might" (Judges 16:30, KJV).(citation needed) Commentators also have employed the term to refer to situations where non-nuclear, non-Israeli actors have threatened conventional weapons retaliation.[2 jpost 2004-06-23] Many things in Israel are named after Samson or reference his story, including the local name of the [[Lockheed C-130 Hercules]].(Maariv 25 October 2016) The story of Samson also appears in the anthem of the [[Hilltop Youth]], a currently active [[Israeli settler violence |settler militant group]].(Haaretz 2024-03-16) The name "Operation Shimshon" (מבצע שמשון Mivtza Shimshon) has been used at least twice. The Lehi militant group used "Operation Shimshon" as the name of a [[suicide operation]] in 1947. Twenty years later, it was the name for a nuclear deployment contingency during the [[Six-Day War]].(Kikar HaShabbat 6 October 2024) Then in May 2025, [[Benjamin Netenyahu]] reportedly rejected the name "Operation Shimshon" (מבצע שמשון Mivtza Shimshon) for the [[May 2025 Gaza offensive]] by saying, "The name evokes a connotation of Samson's saying: 'My soul will die with the Philistines', but we do not intend to die with them. We want them to die alone".(Netenyahu quote ×3) === Militant suicide operations === When the Lehi militant group were discussing ways to assassinate General Evelyn Barker, the British Army commander in Mandatory Palestine, a young woman volunteered to do the assassination as a suicide bombing.[5][6][7] She said "Let my soul die with the Philistines [he]" as a reference to the Samson story in the Hebrew Bible.[5][6][7] Other members of the group rejected her offer.[5][7][6] Two Zionist militants, who had both been sentenced to death by the British authorities for "terrorism" related offences, blew themselves up with improvised hand grenades in Jerusalem prison shortly before midnight on 21 April 1947.(Haarerz 4 April 2007)(Daily Mercury 23 April 1947) According to the Lehi veteran who constructed the explosives, Begin personally approved his own militant, the Lehi militant's death row cell mate, being included in the plan.(Israel Hayom 2021-05-21)(Haaretz 4 April 2007) == Nuclear ambiguity ==

1. "All the way to the gallows: The last days of Meyer Feinstein" כל הדרך לגרדום: ימיו האחרונים של מאיר פיינשטיין. Makor Rishon (in Hebrew). 27 July 2017.
2. Sheleg, Yair (29 March 2007). "60 years after the suicide of the Gallows pilgrim - the Bible returns to its family" 60 שנים אחרי התאבדותו של עולה הגרדום - התנ"ך חוזר למשפחתו. Haaretz.
3. Keinon, Herb (31 January 2002), "Selling the 'Samson option'", The Jerusalem Post, archived from the original on 2004-06-23
4. "The "Shimshon": One of the most significant aircraft in the operational activities of the Air Force" ה"שמשון": אחד המטוסים המשמעותיים ביותר בפעילות המבצעית של חיל האוויר. Maariv (newspaper) (in Hebrew). 25 October 2016.
5. Rinon, Yoav (2024-03-16). "The destructive wish for revenge followed by suicide is rooted in the Israeli ethos". Haaretz.
6. שפירא, ישראל (6 October 2024). "כך הגרעין הישראלי הכניע את מעצמות המערב - ללא שהופעל" [History and current affairs: This is how the Israeli nuclear weapon subdued the Western powers - without being activated]. Kikar HaShabbat (website) (in Hebrew). כבר ערב מלחמת ששת הימים ביוני 1967, כשישראל חששה לגורלה, היא הרכיבה במהירות מתקן גרעיני מאולתר ואיימה להפעילו, לפי החוקר ד"ר אבנר כהן. (הארץ, "הדילמה של דיין", 6.4.2017) זה היה הרמז הראשון ל"מבצע שמשון"[1] - תרחיש שבו ישראל מפעילה את נשקה הגרעיני כמוצא אחרון, בבחינת "תמות נפשי עם פלשתים". [Already on the eve of the Six-Day War in June 1967, when Israel feared for its fate, it quickly assembled an improvised nuclear device and threatened to activate it, according to researcher Dr. Avner Cohen … This was the first hint of "Operation Samson" … a scenario in which Israel activates its nuclear weapons as a last resort, in the sense of "let my soul die with the Philistines".] (automated translation)
7. All have the same quote in Hebrew "השם מעורר קונוטציה לאמירתו של שמשון: 'תמות נפשי עם פלשתים' – אבל אנחנו לא מתכוונים למות איתם. אנחנו רוצים שהם ימותו לבד" (translation is automated)
   • https://www.inn.co.il/news/668345
   • https://www.bhol.co.il/news/1693348
   • https://www.c14.co.il/article/1205080
8. "SUICIDE OF TWO CONDEMNED JEW TERRORISTS". Daily Mercury. 23 April 1947.
9. Weisstuch, Moshe (2021-05-21). "At 98: The underground fighter who helped the suicide of the Gallows immigrants has no regrets" בגיל 98: לוחם המחתרת שסייע להתאבדות עולי הגרדום לא מתחרט. Israel Hayom (in Hebrew).
10. Sheleg, Yair (4 April 2007). "The good jailer" הסוהר הטוב. Haaretz.

2405:6E00:630:9D27:B934:91A7:755E:F419 (talk) 21:15, 30 June 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Not done for now: Hi 2405:6E00:630:9D27:B934:91A7:755E:F419,

Thanks for all the detailed content proposals—there are some really interesting points here. Before we can approve or implement any of these changes, could you please:

1. Provide inline citations for each new fact or moved sentence, formatted like:

   “<text>”<ref>{{cite …}}</ref>

2. Use reliable, secondary sources wherever possible:
   1. Academic works, books, or mainstream news outlets for historical details (e.g., the Doré-illustrated Bible handed to the prisoner in 1947).
   2. Trusted newspapers (Haaretz, Maariv, Israel Hayom) or scholarly publications—rather than partisan blogs (INN, C14) or anonymous aggregators.
   3. A neutral source for the Netanyahu quote about “Operation Shimshon” in 2025.

Once we have those verbatim text changes and solid citations, the edits can be reviewed and applied cleanly. Thanks!

Dahawk04 (talk) 14:08, 10 July 2025 (UTC)[reply]

@Dahawk04 I'll try to fix the formatting. Thank you for showing the example, I couldn't get it to work before and I thought it just didn't work in the blue and yellow boxes. It turns out a bit differently and I got confused.

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text text

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text text

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text text

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text text

1. Reference
2. Book.
3. Book.
4. Reference

It mostly worked when I copied your example, but the numbers but the numbers still don't show up. Is this how it's supposed to work? 2405:6E00:630:F6FD:80A6:EC31:CDB4:565 (talk) 21:15, 12 July 2025 (UTC)[reply]

I'll leave the "^[1](Haaretz 4 April 2007)" style references in the blue box because I can't get it working to show footnote numbers like it does on the page or in this reply. I have a few other sources to add, I'll add those soon. 2405:6E00:630:F6FD:DDFB:9610:3D1C:6943 (talk) 03:12, 15 July 2025 (UTC)[reply]

I added the references that were already on the page. 2405:6E00:630:F6FD:DDFB:9610:3D1C:6943 (talk) 07:16, 15 July 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Reference

1. Sheleg, Yair (4 April 2007). "The good jailer" הסוהר הטוב. Haaretz.

Edit request 12 July 2025

The paragraph about the Lehi in the Background section belongs in the Samson article, not the Samson Option article, as its only connection to the Samson Option is the reference to Samson. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2600:4040:50BF:D400:6DC2:36E:6319:A189 (talk) 10:58, 12 July 2025 (UTC)[reply]